Anyone want to tell me about a good musky guide in the area?
Maybe this summer I'll go see what it's all about....
Musky Guide?
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SCUBA_STEVE
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Not chartering locals????
Does this makes any sense??? Can any muskie guides make any comments?
What about a local guy that does not own a boat, like me. I can't get a muskie charter in the Ottawa area?
What if I have a boat but I am new to muskie fishing. It is better for the muskie fishery for me to learn it by myself? So I can mishandle (vertical hold, hand in the gills...) and catch a some muskie on light tackle and over play them, so lactic acid can build up in the fish and not survive after release????
Doesn't sound like a good idea to me? If a guide is not booked with out of towners, he would prefer to not charter a local fisherman and make no money???
JimW
Does this makes any sense??? Can any muskie guides make any comments?
What about a local guy that does not own a boat, like me. I can't get a muskie charter in the Ottawa area?
What if I have a boat but I am new to muskie fishing. It is better for the muskie fishery for me to learn it by myself? So I can mishandle (vertical hold, hand in the gills...) and catch a some muskie on light tackle and over play them, so lactic acid can build up in the fish and not survive after release????
Doesn't sound like a good idea to me? If a guide is not booked with out of towners, he would prefer to not charter a local fisherman and make no money???
JimW
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bucketmouth
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Never heard of that before Matt. Not around here anyway. I know Kert from MuskyStalker Charters does and so does Bill Craig. Not sure about others but I'm sure someone can chime in and set us straight here.muskymatt wrote:most local musky guides won't charter locals, rightfully so!
When it's in your backyard you have to learn it
bucket
I understand Matt's view on this. What he is saying is why would a guide want to take out a local and show him the rope's when there is a very high percentage that the spot's will be shared with others locals and soon enough receive higher numbers of anglers in those areas than normal, or even worse, start there own charter using the runs that the guide has shown him 
. Not that this has not already happened 
He would be basically cutting his own throat.. If your guide notices you fishing for muskie in spots that he has shown you, not to mention shown you how to fish for them, what do you think will be going threw his mind. I guarantee you that he won't be thinking, " Hey there is that nice guy I guided a month or so ago, Oh and look he has brought a couple of his Buddy's with there own boat, Right on ". So it makes perfect sense not to want to guide locals, although as Bucketmouth said, "They do". I know Kurt, and Bill are a couple of great guides that don't mind sharing some good info. but I also think they are a little to kind sometimes...
. Not that this has not already happened He would be basically cutting his own throat.. If your guide notices you fishing for muskie in spots that he has shown you, not to mention shown you how to fish for them, what do you think will be going threw his mind. I guarantee you that he won't be thinking, " Hey there is that nice guy I guided a month or so ago, Oh and look he has brought a couple of his Buddy's with there own boat, Right on ". So it makes perfect sense not to want to guide locals, although as Bucketmouth said, "They do". I know Kurt, and Bill are a couple of great guides that don't mind sharing some good info. but I also think they are a little to kind sometimes...HOF
thats pretty accurate!!
And the part about going to yoour fav. spot and seeing the guy you had in your boat last week , that would be enough to cheese you off.
I'm not saying " and I'm not speaking on their behalf" that they would never take any local ever , just they are not their high % of cliental.
I have been luky enough to have gone fishing with a couple of guides and I'm sure they don't take me to thei fav. spots and I would never ask them too. I'm a member of muskies Can. I got pieces of info on spots over the years and put together more pcs by trial and error, With over 3 years with MCI and so many hours on the water it's sickening I still only consider myself a medium experience Musky angler. Some of these guys didn't put all the pieces together for 10 years or more .Why should they just give away that experience.
I enjoy the thrill of exploring new spots and thats what is exciting about muskie fishing" the hunt"
thats pretty accurate!!
And the part about going to yoour fav. spot and seeing the guy you had in your boat last week , that would be enough to cheese you off.
I'm not saying " and I'm not speaking on their behalf" that they would never take any local ever , just they are not their high % of cliental.
I have been luky enough to have gone fishing with a couple of guides and I'm sure they don't take me to thei fav. spots and I would never ask them too. I'm a member of muskies Can. I got pieces of info on spots over the years and put together more pcs by trial and error, With over 3 years with MCI and so many hours on the water it's sickening I still only consider myself a medium experience Musky angler. Some of these guys didn't put all the pieces together for 10 years or more .Why should they just give away that experience.
I enjoy the thrill of exploring new spots and thats what is exciting about muskie fishing" the hunt"
Last edited by muskymatt on Sat Mar 11, 2006 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
Didn't meen to po anybody with that post Jim. There are lots of sites that you can gat basic knowledge of fish handleing from.JimW wrote:Not chartering locals????
Does this makes any sense??? Can any muskie guides make any comments?
What about a local guy that does not own a boat, like me. I can't get a muskie charter in the Ottawa area?
What if I have a boat but I am new to muskie fishing. It is better for the muskie fishery for me to learn it by myself? So I can mishandle (vertical hold, hand in the gills...) and catch a some muskie on light tackle and over play them, so lactic acid can build up in the fish and not survive after release????
Doesn't sound like a good idea to me? If a guide is not booked with out of towners, he would prefer to not charter a local fisherman and make no money???
JimW
How does a guy like you with no boat get out muskie fishing????
call me sometime and I'll take you out.
I 'm no guide but I have put several of my buds onto big fish!
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Trophymuskie
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Some great points have already been mentioned before. From a business stand point I can guide an American from 900 miles away for a 4 day average at over $2000 or a local for maybe $450 for a day and have him fish my techniques on the spots I showed him and follow me around to find others maybe for life.
You will find that the majority of muskie anglers are very limited at to whom they will go out and fish with. Muskie fishing is hard and good spots are far and few in between. For every guy you take out it's another boat or three pounding your spots.
I have no problem taking out a local kid, business man or even a guy just wanting to learn the basics. Naturally I'm not going to be fishing my A spots or my special techniques. That is one thing that I pride myself on giving my clients 110% and I just can't do that with locals. I don't think it giving my 110% when I take clients out fishing and there are guys on half the spots I take them too ether. It may be hard to believe but I still have some great spots to myself and others that get fished by many but completely wrong.
There is not enough money out there for me to give up my spots, even before I started to guide whenever I would be fishng with buddies well we would not be doing that well. Naturally it's because we have two different thinking individuals onboard but most likely it's because I would not fish my best spots and techniques period.
Fishing pressure is the enemy of muskie fishing, I had a buddy ( well he used to be a buddy ) move to an area of the river. I tried to explain to him that he needs to move around to put less pressure on the fish as I have been very successfull not fishing the same spots but once or twice a week max. He refused to listen to me and pounded the area that he lives at every time out and in only the second year the fishing went down, it's now become my lease favorite area as I have to work a lot harder and find new spots to fish as muskies will leave areas that get pounded day after day. I still caught a lot of big fish there last year by doing something different on different spots and he only caught one pounding the same old spots (he also fished that area a lot more then I did).
You have to remember this is my livelyhood, if the fishing goes south so will my business.
P.S. There are muskie guides in Montreal that have their clients swear (They just tell them) to never come back on their own. If you refuse they won't take you out no matter how much money you have.
You will find that the majority of muskie anglers are very limited at to whom they will go out and fish with. Muskie fishing is hard and good spots are far and few in between. For every guy you take out it's another boat or three pounding your spots.
I have no problem taking out a local kid, business man or even a guy just wanting to learn the basics. Naturally I'm not going to be fishing my A spots or my special techniques. That is one thing that I pride myself on giving my clients 110% and I just can't do that with locals. I don't think it giving my 110% when I take clients out fishing and there are guys on half the spots I take them too ether. It may be hard to believe but I still have some great spots to myself and others that get fished by many but completely wrong.
There is not enough money out there for me to give up my spots, even before I started to guide whenever I would be fishng with buddies well we would not be doing that well. Naturally it's because we have two different thinking individuals onboard but most likely it's because I would not fish my best spots and techniques period.
Fishing pressure is the enemy of muskie fishing, I had a buddy ( well he used to be a buddy ) move to an area of the river. I tried to explain to him that he needs to move around to put less pressure on the fish as I have been very successfull not fishing the same spots but once or twice a week max. He refused to listen to me and pounded the area that he lives at every time out and in only the second year the fishing went down, it's now become my lease favorite area as I have to work a lot harder and find new spots to fish as muskies will leave areas that get pounded day after day. I still caught a lot of big fish there last year by doing something different on different spots and he only caught one pounding the same old spots (he also fished that area a lot more then I did).
You have to remember this is my livelyhood, if the fishing goes south so will my business.
P.S. There are muskie guides in Montreal that have their clients swear (They just tell them) to never come back on their own. If you refuse they won't take you out no matter how much money you have.
Last edited by Trophymuskie on Sat Mar 11, 2006 8:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
Catch and release them all
Richard Collin
Richard Collin
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Lookinforlunkers
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Interesting post - a mixture of ethics and business strategy. And it's a probelm that the guides have to face. I took a charter 3 years ago from a local guide - didn't catch but we did raise one. I learned some of the basic techniques of trolling and casting, then went out on my own. I will admit that I did pound the same area for a few months after but I only managed 1 36" for my effort. Since then Iv'e read magazines, watched videos, and joined MCI. My catch rate has gone up but it's not great. If you go with a guide and stick to the same technique and area that he showed you, you will not improve and dissolusion will set in. While I still look for the guide boats when I see their trucks at the ramp, I now find myself looking for different areas for structure that may yeild a muskie that no one else fishes - or so I hope 
Lookinforlunkers has the right of it, join MCI, I think you will learn more there. Do you want to go out and catch one fish for $300 or spend that $300 on tackle and MCI membership? Beware, Muskie fishing is addictive, expensive and those winters are looonngg.......
Lookinforlunkers has the right of it, join MCI, I think you will learn more there. Do you want to go out and catch one fish for $300 or spend that $300 on tackle and MCI membership? Beware, Muskie fishing is addictive, expensive and those winters are looonngg.......
I like figuring things out for myself and finding my own fish. I've gone on a few lake Ontario charters with friends and never counted the fish I reeled in as fish I actually caught - I got the fish only because it was my turn. It doesn't make any difference to casual fishermen though - a fish reeled in is a fish reeled in, end of story.
Hiring a guide can provide you with information you can use and apply elsewhere. Whether you are fishing with a guide, or a good friend, I would not feel right beating on someone elses spots. If its local waters, you shouldn't have to hire a guide - go out and use you eyes, join a club, search the internet. The best spots are your own spots, spots you found that haven't become community holes.
I remember a long time ago, scrutineering the old OV pro bass series on Big Rideau (you ride with a pro, who fishes alone). I learned his spots. Later that fall there was another two day tournament on the same water, which both he and I entered separately. I wanted to fish one of his spots, but waited until day two to do it. They showed up just after we did. and I felt pretty uncomfortable, although he seemed not to be put off by it.
Using a guide is a bit like using a cheat sheet - you paid the other guy to do the hard work and you just reel em' in and say you caught it. I suppose if you're casting, your doing some work too, but if your trolling around, that's another story. Your paying big money for a boat ride and some pictures, and hopefully some knowledge.
Hiring a guide can provide you with information you can use and apply elsewhere. Whether you are fishing with a guide, or a good friend, I would not feel right beating on someone elses spots. If its local waters, you shouldn't have to hire a guide - go out and use you eyes, join a club, search the internet. The best spots are your own spots, spots you found that haven't become community holes.
I remember a long time ago, scrutineering the old OV pro bass series on Big Rideau (you ride with a pro, who fishes alone). I learned his spots. Later that fall there was another two day tournament on the same water, which both he and I entered separately. I wanted to fish one of his spots, but waited until day two to do it. They showed up just after we did. and I felt pretty uncomfortable, although he seemed not to be put off by it.
Using a guide is a bit like using a cheat sheet - you paid the other guy to do the hard work and you just reel em' in and say you caught it. I suppose if you're casting, your doing some work too, but if your trolling around, that's another story. Your paying big money for a boat ride and some pictures, and hopefully some knowledge.
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MuskieStalker1
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Good thread
I personaly do not have a problem with taking out locals. I do not agree with top raider. My first muskie experiance was with a guide on the french river . In fact we did not see a fish but he tought me some fundementals i still teach my clients today. By talking to each individual client and finding out what they expect allows me to individulize each pearsons day . In turn this gives the client the most customized day i can provide.
Kert Lavigne
Muskie Stalker
Kert Lavigne
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steve-hamilton
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This is what a GOOD muskie guide does
I took Davis Battah out, Figure Eight Muskie Charters....he said right at the beginning, he knew part of the 'sale' is also selling spots, not just the chance to catch....ALL guided trips are like this....
Well, sure as crap, six months later, I"M in Davis's spots he showed me, with friends, fishing for muskie....just like what was said above....
Only difference? Davis is professional. he asked how we were doing, if were had caught anything, then LENDED ME his fav spinnerbait for the day, as i didn't have a hot colour....
THEN, when i actually caught one later in the day, on the bait, and told him, (and showed him the fish on digicam), he gave me the lure.
THATS how you treat customers, muskie guides.
I took Davis Battah out, Figure Eight Muskie Charters....he said right at the beginning, he knew part of the 'sale' is also selling spots, not just the chance to catch....ALL guided trips are like this....
Well, sure as crap, six months later, I"M in Davis's spots he showed me, with friends, fishing for muskie....just like what was said above....
Only difference? Davis is professional. he asked how we were doing, if were had caught anything, then LENDED ME his fav spinnerbait for the day, as i didn't have a hot colour....
THEN, when i actually caught one later in the day, on the bait, and told him, (and showed him the fish on digicam), he gave me the lure.
THATS how you treat customers, muskie guides.