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What I DO BELIEVE, and you'll have a hard time shutting me up on this one, is that fish that are to be released should be handled in the best possible manner. If that means spending a few extra dollars on the best equipment available- net, pliers, side-cutters, whatever- or taking a few extra seconds to carefully remove a hook instead of tearing it out, I believe it's worth it.
Does this include slinging bass into your boat tourney style...bouncing them off the deck off your boat....pouncing on them and chuckin them in a livewell for 6 hours to be weighed in with hopes of cashing a check?.... I guess that doesn't count.....
Not sure if CCB fishes tournaments or not, but I believe he does. If that is the case, then trying to give advice on the proper handling and release practice while whizzing around with bass in a livewell, holding them in plastic bags then showing them off to the crowds.....well, everything should be taken with a grain of salt. Don't get me wrong - I have fished many tournaments in the past, love tournaments and have nothing against those that fish them. However, if you do, you are kinda the last person to be giving advice on proper handling and release tactics. Cause on thing is for sure - If I'm harming each fish that comes in contact with this Magnus net, a tournament angler must be committing murder with their handling practices... (sarcasm involved here)
Now now, we don't need a debate on tournament C&R practices. A lot of those tournament guys take the best care they can in making sure their bass stay alive & unharmed.
Hey Rich,
I'm not looking for a debate. Like I said, I'm all for tournament angling. However, it leaves a bit of a dry taste in my mouth for someone to hijack a net thread, make those that use "X" nets out to be responsible for depleted fish stocks, then go on a spiel about correct handling and release practices. That's fine. But, if you feel so strongly about that, and feel that a knot in some nylon is doing so much damage, then it's time to think twice about why you fish tournaments. Because as I stated, running with fish in a well all day, and holding them in plastic bags or on stage is far more detrimental to a fish than scooping them up in a net. That doesn't even need to be discussed. It's a no-brainer.
But, I would love to hear CCB side of how when he is in a tourney, he is being more responsible and conservation-minded than the rest of us.
Don't think there's any getting out of that one.
Time to move on from this. (I hear there's something going on in the world called ice fishing!)
[/quote]In Big Jim's article praising FH.net as a great place for him and all others who love angling to hang out.....he talked of no pecking order being in place....just a great bunch of folk talking fishing....folks who come off as an authority in their mind simply get this... ..over and over again.....something to keep in mind.... RJ[/quote]
Right out of the gate I will openly state that I have not read Big Jim's article so whether or not he mentioned "no pecking order" on Fish Hawk is something that I take for granted as stated above. I also freely admit I am no authority on much of anything - but I am pretty familiar with the English language and all of its subtleties.
Big Jim is a Canadian fishing legend and he has been welcomed on this site IMHO like no other before him. If he stated that there is no pecking order, my opinion is that he has simply not experienced the pecking order in his limited time here.
There is clearly a pecking order on Fish Hawk. It very, very clearly exists. Some of those at the top of the pecking order do come off as authorities quite regularly, particularly in their attempts to "educate" relatively new anglers or new posters. In fact, sometimes these "authorities" get IMHO down right hostile in their attempts to educate.
What really bothers me more than anything though is that people have opinions and their right to an opinion. Some folks here believe that there are two types of opinions: theirs and wrong opinions. And that is truly unfortunate as there is alot to learn from the information posted here.
Talk about hi-jacking threads! You, sir must be joking! What, exactly, are you doing now?
I'll play along, though.
I've fished quite a few tournaments over the years. I fished a couple this past season, but likely won't fish any this coming season as I'll be spending my time on the water with my two nephews who have gotten the fishing bug.
RJ- I have never swung a bass and bounced it off the deck, pounced on it, then "chucked" it in the livewell. I treat all fish with great care- as do most tournament anglers. If you mishandle fish like that, then shame on you.
Back to Justin: I fished only tournaments that treat the fish well -eg. Renegade Bass. I have had one fish die on me in approx. 200 tournaments over the past 20 years. The fish are released to fight another day. Not considered groceries. I have THREE livewell systems that run continuously, and the fish are just as fiesty at the time of release as when they were caught. Well-run tournaments have very low delayed mortality rates. I won't offer up any studies to back this up since you and others here seem to fear or at least discount scientific information.
Now, mind you, the derbies (or whatever you fished) probably had guys dragging fish around on stringers and so on. Go to a well run tournament and you will see things have progressed from there. You've branded tournament anglers, sarcastically (of course) as murderers. Yep. Right on.
Tournament anglers have given up all rights to advise on the proper handling of fish according to your post. Or at least you should take take everything they say with a grain of salt. That seem reasonable to everyone?
As far as the pecking order here goes, I think you have to look at the few that prefer lengthy threads on the homophobic aspects of pink ice-huts. Amazing that some believe that lovely thread is more at home here than a post trying to generate awareness of a fish-friendly mesh.
Finally, to answer this: I would love to hear CCB(sic) side of how when he is in a tourney, he is being more responsible and conservation-minded than the rest of us. I checked, Justin, and just can't seem to find where I claimed to be more responsible and conservation-minded than anyone. Yep, that's the confused symbol. If you actually plan on becoming any kind of writer when you grow up, you might want to have someone edit your work. Might save you some embarrassment. A word to the wise, of course.
Well I'll give ya credit CCB.....I never expected a response....
I fished only tournaments that treat the fish well -eg. Renegade Bass. I have had one fish die on me in approx. 200 tournaments over the past 20 years. The fish are released to fight another day. Not considered groceries. I have THREE livewell systems that run continuously, and the fish are just as fiesty at the time of release as when they were caught. Well-run tournaments have very low delayed mortality rates. I won't offer up any studies to back this up since you and others here seem to fear or at least discount scientific information.
Mississippi Lake Called......it wants its bass back....and no scientific information can change that story...
Well just got back from the Dominican Republic....glad I didnt miss much,
interesting thread, I agree with Fishhawk, lots of different opinions, no reason to get excited. Some catch and release, some catch and keep. I hate to break the news but I actually own several nets. A big one for salmon that will be kept, a small rubber slide type for trout that will go back.A cradle for Pike and Lunge that seems to work well. Thats the individuality I believe we all have the right too.
I wont belabour the point but there was an indepth article , I believe by Infisherman, several years ago and reprinted in part in one of the US big three that actually showed Xray reproductions of the fracture damage done to the lower jaw bone in the mouths of bass after being lifted out of the water by their bottom lip. I would submit that we should all be considerate to the fact that no matter how we take that fish out of the water , we are definately increasing the risk of mortality. But I guess we accept that as part of what we do.
Well, since you feel it necessary to continue with this, why not. I'm going to make these points simple and easy to understand, and perhaps then you will realize where I, and quite a few others are coming from.
Here is what you recently wrote: What I DO BELIEVE, and you'll have a hard time shutting me up on this one, is that fish that are to be released should be handled in the best possible manner. If that means spending a few extra dollars on the best equipment available- net, pliers, side-cutters, whatever- or taking a few extra seconds to carefully remove a hook instead of tearing it out, I believe it's worth it.
Do you not for a minute believe that tournament weigh-in practices, or the act of carrying fish in your craft for an entire day, does not do more harm than simply netting a fish, even in a knotted variety? You must be very mislead if you believe it doesn't. My whole point of bringing up tournaments was to highlight the fact that some of your practices are at least as damaging, and actually more damaging than the kind you are accusing those on the original thread of. You seemed quite quick to point out this imaginary fact:
After all, if 10 Hawk-Talkers buy the nets and net 50 fish per year over the next 10 years, and assume just 4-5% more (released) fish die as a result, that's only 200-250 additional floaters...
Not sure where you came up with your figures for that, yet you seem convinced that your tournament practices has not affected fish mortality one bit, according to this hum-dinger:
The fish are released to fight another day. Not considered groceries. I have THREE livewell systems that run continuously, and the fish are just as fiesty at the time of release as when they were caught. Well-run tournaments have very low delayed mortality rates.
Do you know for a fact that your fish are released to fight another day? Funny you would have such authoritative stats on net users, yet you've only had one fish die in all of your tournament pursuits. I'm sure there are a lot of studies out there on tournament mortality, ones catering to bass and not bluegill. But I'll leave that to you to Google up.
And this was good: I have had one fish die on me in approx. 200 tournaments over the past 20 years.
Do you honestly believe that. You have no clue as to your fish's mortality. You had one fish die on you in the well, but how many died after their release. I'd like to think they would be at least as high as your net hypothesis, but then again, you don't seem to think that having fish bounce around in a boat all day, or weighed out in the field while culling, or held in plastic bags or plastic crates, then posed on stage does anything towards lessening a bass's life. Must be great to know so much to something that is out of your hands at the end of the day.
As for branding tournament anglers murderers, come on. There was a reason for putting in the bracketed sarcasm note. Like I said, I've fished tournaments and have nothing against those that do. I was simply making a comparison to how you believe harm can be done to these nets, simply by stating that your practice of fishing these tournaments has just as equal of an effect. But you don't seem to recognize that equation..
One other thing - do you not use a net when fishing tournaments? When you have a money fish on the line, that you best defence against lost fish, breakoffs, and ultimately, disappointment. But of course, CCB doesn't have net..Foolish me, but I sure wouldn't want to be your tournament partner, and sit there with baited breath while you tried to hand land a 5-pounder to put him in the well..
Now to answer some of your questions. No, never fished a derby here. In fact, I have only fished well-known and professional circuits. Fished the very first Bassontaio tournament on Scugog at the age of 16, two series of Top Bass (making it to the Classic in my first year). I also fished an Under-115 series, as well as one other. I also stepped onto the podium at the age of 17 to cash a cheque. I've fished against Izumi and Crawford, and beat out Peach by ounces to cash a cheque at one event. So, yes, I have a bit of experience in the matter. But thanks for the derby shot. Another insinuation on your part, for which you're getting quite good at.
As for the immature statement "if you actually plan on becoming any kind of writer when you grow up, you might want to have someone edit your work," thanks, but at 32 years of age, I believe I've grown up. I also believe my status with OOD, my publishing credits that range from Outdoor Canada and Real Fishing to Bass Pro and Fishing Facts, and my relationship and status with companies in the fishing industry, speaks for itself. But I appreciate your spell-checking of my work - sorry, I guess I'm not as anal as you in that respect.
But hey, when you resort to insinuating people as 'whackos', or that they need to grow up, one should look in the mirror and possibly tell themselves the same.
I enjoy discussing as much as the next, but when you don't take responsibility for your own actions, nor admit that you are possibly doing harm within your own practices, there's really no point in discussing things further.
Thanks for the fun times, CCB. Feel free to edit this post, as I'm sure you'd relish in that...
Good Fishing,
Justin
Last edited by JustinHoffman on Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
If you mostly fish Bass and have rod lockers, then check out the Hibernet. It easily straps down on the deck with the rods and stays out of the way until needed. Ahhh... it does have a nylon net.
RJ- I have never swung a bass and bounced it off the deck, pounced on it, then "chucked" it in the livewell. I treat all fish with great care- as do most tournament anglers. If you mishandle fish like that, then shame on you.
Come on, we have all done this, I admit I have.
You've branded tournament anglers, sarcastically (of course) as murderers. Yep. Right on.
I hope to become a serial killer this year!
Can we open this thread for fishing for Bass during the spawn ?????
You know its winter!
G
Last edited by grumpy7790 on Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
(sarcasm involved here) 
..over and over again.....something to keep in mind.... RJ[/quote]
What, exactly, are you doing now?
?????